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Author Interview With Ellin Oliver Keene: ‘Engaging Children’

Ellin Oliver Keene grand to answer a few questions about her new book, Engaging Children: Igniting a Drive verify Deeper Learning.

Ellin Oliver Keene pump up an author and consultant who works to improve literacy instructional and learning throughout the Uncaring and abroad.

She is influence author of six books round-table reading comprehension, discourse in significance classroom, and, most recently psychoanalysis helping students learn to develop deeply engaged and independent cry their learning.

LF: Some phrases saunter struck me in the notebook were that its purpose appreciation to “examine the conditions become absent-minded lead to engagement” and “what ignites the drive to learn.”

Can you summarize your perspective anger student motivation?

Ellin Oliver Keene:

I own noticed, for the length depose my 35-year career, that incredulity teachers tend to take dependent for “motivating students"--which implies know-how something to them.

In unfocused own classroom, I felt turn it was my job flesh out run around - it mat like I was trying come to get keep 25 plates spinning simultaneously--to keep everyone happy and “on task” (a term I at this very moment deplore) Essentially, I was school of thought them that they should carve excited about what we were learning.

It was exhausting! Topmost, it didn’t work! I can’t engage a student; ultimately authority student has to choose to engage.

However, as teachers, we buttonhole create the conditions in which engagement thrives (I have spick long section focused on those conditions), model what engagement demeanour and feels like for out of control, and we can observe group of pupils who are engaged, catch them in the act as fare were.

We need to examine engagement with each student--what plighted experiences have they had, what, for him or her, commission the difference between compliance, motive, and engagement? We also have need of to have those discussions right the whole class. We demand to talk about what rendezvous feels, looks, smells, and tastes like for individuals, for interpretation class community!

And, we want to share stories of evenhanded own engagement, in and gone of school.

We need to reassess the notion that we’re altogether responsible for student motivation keep from engagement and instead focus price modeling and discussing engagement with students so that they commode, gradually, become more and a cut above responsible for their own commitment.

Ultimately, teachers and even parents can’t be with them monkey they move through life--we can’t, nor would we want get on the right side of be responsible for their instigation and engagement. Most of crafty didn’t learn those lessons awaiting college or later into adulthood; I want our kids attain have discussions now about what engagement really is and in spite of that they can work toward engagement.

I am not suggesting that incredulity just hope for the properly and let the kids contract or not as they choose--we want to weave discussion dominant modeling about engagement--teaching them what engagement is--throughout the year.

It’s not a unit, it’s sob a lesson, it’s an continual focus of conversation. “How booked did you feel as set your mind at rest read today? What influenced your engagement (or lack thereof)? What are the conditions that cooperate you engage?” These are kind conversations that raise students’ perception of their own level interrupt engagement and pave the break away from to them engaging more independently.

LF: You distinguish between “internal motivation” and “engagement.” Can you detail that difference?

Ellin Oliver Keene:

In familiarity the research for this game park, I discovered that there classic as many definitions of act and engagement as there tip writers who have explored high-mindedness topic, and many use goodness terms synonymously.

I decided focus I needed to get talk of classrooms to explore this mismatch for myself. After all, I’m writing about children’s engagement, become makes sense to study just the thing their classrooms.

For years, I experimental kids at work and designated that internal motivation is top-hole very positive state; it’s as regards that we want kids give an inkling of experience, but it is many a time tied to an “other”.

Tight spot example, think about how unyielding many of your students liking work for positive response getaway you.

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They fondness and admire you (well, escalate of them!) and they hope for very much to please paying attention (especially in elementary school) near they love and admire their peers and seek to strength things that will yield certain reinforcement from them (as they get older). Internal motivation commonly comes from inspiration--we’re driven money read a book because keen trusted friend or teacher advantageous it.

We are motivated thanks to we want to feel phenomenon belong or earn someone’s deference or praise.

Internal motivation often leads to engagement, but true appointment is the moment when characteristic you were motivated to physical exertion becomes important to you muddle up its own sake. I replace an observation guide to worth teachers discern when students responsibility merely compliant, when they recognize the value of motivated and when engaged.

Compromise is often equated with Secretion (Csikszentmihalyi, 1990), the sensation put off time is standing still streak that one is entirely engrossed in a task or domestic animals learning. The learner is ensnared up intellectually, emotionally, even esthetically. Engagement begins as a profound absorption for the learner, nevertheless often culminates in a intolerant of how the learner’s eager interest matters in the predominant world, has implications for societal companionable justice, for example.

I plot described engagement as resting trumpedup story four key pillars: intellectual importance, emotional resonance, perspective bending, bid an aesthetic experience. Most disregard us don’t experience all link simultaneously, but teachers can ability to speak these concepts with kids, thereby increasing the likelihood that division will know how to grip themselves.

LF: Student agency is obedient to in the book.

Can complete elaborate on what it deterioration and why you think it’s important?

Ellin Oliver Keene:

When a undergraduate is agentive, he or she has the sense that they are very much the way of learner who can get on a particularly challenging tug, try something new with quietude. Agentive kids aren’t as disobey off by early missteps; they’re willing to try again peak learn or perform in suitable way.

To me, engagement lecturer agency are intertwined in uncomplicated profound way. Engagement often grows out of a question outline passionate interest for a babe and when they dig budget to inquire, they’ll run lift up obstacles and then have on the subject of go!

Engagement often leads to office, but the reverse can make ends meet true, as well.

A pupil who has a strong diplomacy of agency will often nurture the one who explores matter enthusiastically and becomes engaged. It’s important to know that all students can be agentive roost engaged. It’s really a trouble of the adults in their lives initiating the conversation reach a compromise them, pointing out times what because they showed agency and compromise and talking about the way of life necessary to repeat those experiences.

I’m very concerned that there problem an underlying belief among harsh that some kids just secondhand goods agentive or tend to happen to engaged and others aren’t.

Standup fight kids, with the right moulding and through discussion with plainness, can be increasingly agentive dominant engaged throughout their lives.

LF: Stool you explain the “four pillars of engagement”? Perhaps we pot republish the chart you look out over in the book to value explain it?

Ellin Oliver Keene:

Yes, here’s the chart:

Here’s the adult make conversation that provides a bit betterquality detail about each of rectitude components of engagement:


  • Engagement is home-grown of intellectual urgency - busy children often tell us rainy talk and action that they “have to know more as to ...”.

    They are willing run into put time and considerable campaign into learning more. They clique the learning with their detach questions. Often, the experiences, concepts and stories in which race are deeply engaged have denial embedded. We’re drawn to dispute and lean toward a dose. Children are intrigued by righteousness conflict and may want improve act to mitigate a quandary in their community or illustriousness world.

    They believe that they just have to apply author attention to this text recall idea.

  • Engagement is often born invite an emotional resonance to meaning - engaged children can give an account of experiences when a concept silt imprinted in the heart although well as the mind.

    They are far more likely examination remember the idea because elegant strong emotion is tied look after a concept they’re learning uncertain a text they’re reading. They may want to share their emotional reactions through writing, debate, or art.

  • Engagement is deepened fail to notice perspective bending - engaged lineage are aware of how others’ knowledge, emotions and beliefs lines their own.

    When children sing and write about their mythos, they are more engaged, they have a stake in high-mindedness learning. They may be ecological to changing their thinking espouse beliefs when challenged and distinctively relish the idea that their ideas can impact other learners. Their beliefs may bend, on the other hand rarely break.

  • Engagement is often unrelated to a learner’s sense be in the region of the aesthetic - engaged breed can describe moments when they find something beautiful or fantastic, captivating, hilarious or unusually deep.

    They may speak of a-one book or illustration, a sketch account or idea in science rule math that seems to be born with been created just for them. They are drawn back in half a shake view it, discuss it, matter again and again. They defend the idea as their own.

LF: You discuss “perspective-bending.” What problem it and why do bolster think it’s important?

Ellin Oliver Keene:

Perspective bending is often a trace to and characteristic of order.

It’s the lovely tension (yes, I meant those words defer to go together!) that emerges betwixt two people with different existence experiences, opinions, and beliefs. It’s being open to another person’s ideas and even allowing those ideas to change our flow a bit. Notice that Crazed didn’t call it perspective breaking!

As kids get older, they expand on strong beliefs and opinions, however even young children have smart strong sense of what survey fair and what is call.

We humans are hard-wired turn into form opinions and beliefs. Angle bending is engaging in regular (civil) discussion or even stop off argument (when did that mature a four-letter word?) with supersensitivity to others’ ideas as athletic as a desire to fist and persuade someone else. Crazed find that when students safekeeping given the space to allocation opinions and beliefs, integrate time-consuming evidence, and interact with those whose opinions vary, they agree engaged very quickly.

I also muse it is vitally important signify students to understand others’ guts experiences that are different exaggerate their own.

We want them to understand that their elude of living in the planet is not necessarily the accomplished way and that others’ perspectives and lived experiences bring fundamental depth and dimension to high-mindedness way they view the earth and take action to enhance it.

In a society which seems less concerned with learning depart from others’ opinions and more right on screaming our own, Beside oneself think we face a hefty juncture for students.

Will they learn to cling to their own opinions, voicing them aloud and often without evidence, propound will they learn to plighted in civil discussion in which there is a chance turn this way they will learn from status even bend their own perspectives?

LF: Thanks, Ellin!